I'd bet that CE was skipped as well (as are all "G" combos). 0000012553 00000 n The "not all revolvers are proofed" is unverified since nobody is willing to admit this. 0000105108 00000 n 0000036564 00000 n Proof marks are the official stamps or ciphers showing that a barrel has been properly tested with the prescribed excess charges of powder and ball that allow a large factor of safety to the user. 0000028135 00000 n 0000010816 00000 n 0000049974 00000 n Dashing Leper 36 Cl. 0000064406 00000 n We have just started to assemble this on going source of Proof HT=0+ @|7IqE.sQ"$9>tB}vUe&iF=P[mEjo(lHBRAu)0u^Y_8Ii)uLBAo*3 3SL*l4r_g[#}eF9ihFCym>s@MRFzaVLz8 0000057470 00000 n 1968 = XXIV. In 1849 the additional ciphers for provisional proof the letters E.L. in script, enlaced, and the sign of the tower of Liege a little obelisk upon a pyramidal base, also shown on the right [above]. The standard proving of weapons rose out of the need for protection on the part of the public against unreliable weapons, and it was also a means of protecting the armourer guild and good craftsmen against outside competition with cheap imported arms. %PDF-1.3 % 0000011101 00000 n 0000001752 00000 n Parisa cipher of E. and P. set back to back (as shown below). CF - 2010. 0000001540 00000 n Your gun appears to be made by one of the lesser known companies as it doesn't say Uberti or Pietta. to identify antique arms from different parts of the world, we decided Some older foreign Uberti set the standard for producing quality replica firearms by which all others are judged. . 136 43 0000126405 00000 n 0000087569 00000 n The butt is marked "PFT FIE ITALY", etched "5K8 12 80755". But I am starting to believe this is true. The DGG is the mark of Armi San Paoli, now Euroarms. 0000037090 00000 n {Za%a\#XDs9dE;*ci8=agercR"Vf|^z 96MXKk8}vd+X0L@skz j> 'th,6bB%t%]iNjNyksz+l4 C2&y*8NOalS?E:{'-~+[+GOk-cOcJ( oGljoR_Gb }6[w;vd ! endstream endobj 34 0 obj 782 endobj 35 0 obj << /Filter /FlateDecode /Length 34 0 R >> stream Their health and their love.I love The people I have gotten to meet in sass and the ones that have just talked to on the wire.I do like to shoot and pick on people at the shoot.I love the hugs I get and the ones I will get when I meet some on you people. Bookmark Austrian arms were marked with the double eagle, and later with the letters Wn 78; a variety of private marks of manufacturers are also in use. 0000105361 00000 n 35 45 Most imported black powder replica revolvers are stamped with a variety of markings Italian, Belgian, German, Spanish or other Proof House symbols, manufacturer's symbols, and importer's symbols along with an encoded date of proof, also considered the date of manufacture. 0000001989 00000 n trailer To establish this rule, they constructed a proof house near the City of London. The hammer also wont engage the safety notches (too wide). 1946 = 2. 0000052647 00000 n Re: italian made .44 black powder revolver That's essentially a copy of a copy. THE AMERICAN SPIRIT. There is a complete lack of many records, but with the assistance of many replica collectors from around the world, and especially in France and Italy, we have been able to identify many of them. Revolvers are marked on barrel, on the frame, and on each chamber. Thanks for your help. 0000000016 00000 n H\@OQEcb{+ nb~{:0|wvrqrkx?:S],\hi~,]#M=m.0Mn6sjZ]e/&oKZ!b>^SM U\bw~tWcV.Y,qd^"+"!b^!{w{=2i3{dad:=Npz:=~E~e~MYxGxGxGxGxGx=SOA>} For a better experience, please enable JavaScript in your browser before proceeding. 1810 -> Liege. The same rulses are more or less applied today. 1970 = XXVI. "Proofs" as they are sometimes referred to have changed over http://www.powderhombre.com/mbpproofmarks.pdf You must have Adobe or similar software to read pdf files. 0000015377 00000 n 0000011188 00000 n 0000010481 00000 n 0000080518 00000 n Some of the better reproductions, such as those by Colt, Ruger, or Thompson Center, might tend to retail more in the $100 to $350 range. The most visible change is the change from a crown to a star 1950 so crown and PSF is from the time between 1923 and 1950. Proof Marks or "Proofs" as they are sometimes referred to have changed over time, therefore assisting in dating the arm. +J+J+J+J4+J4+Ji4F`4F`4fCg~1x:4lCC6a` ? ? 0000008224 00000 n INTRODUCTION Most imported black powder replica revolvers are stamped with a variety of markings - Italian, Belgian, German, Spanish or other Proof House symbols, manufacturer's symbols, and importer's symbols along with an encoded date of proof, also considered the date of manufacture. 0000005702 00000 n 0000003744 00000 n 79 0 obj <>stream firearms. The "PN" are the initials for "polere nera" or black powder. cases. 0000005942 00000 n All photos published on this site are the property of the author or are published with the permission of the authors. 0000003896 00000 n Serial Numbers. These So, what follows is a photo library of many of the various Black Powder Proofmarks, Date Codes, Importer, Distributor and Manufacturer's Marks to help with identifying the manufacturer of your revolvers, pistols or rifles. Misc. 0 This "certifies" that each chamber was proofed at 8,800 psi with a 30% plus load. The mark is applied after the gun has passed the Belgian proof. I relative gave me a .36 Colt-type percussion revolver. If it is a fake it's more likely any of the Italian proof marks and makers stamps were carefully filed off or filled then filed. Taking the bbl off is the first thing I did - there are no markings on the underside anywhere. There used to be an odd-duck that came about several ways. marks tell the country of origin of the weapon. Quick View Add to Cart . 0000124308 00000 n Get this product now as it would not last. H\j0~ and an eagles head. My revolver seems to have no date marks on it anywhere. 0000011024 00000 n The Italian proof test markings are three (see picture) The first one (two letters in a rectangle) represent the year of prooftesting. Peacekeepers, Molalla River Rangers, ORANGE COUNTY REGULATORS,UP THE CREEK GANG ,LIFE MEMBER OF JACKSON HOLE REGULATORS,DOOLEY GANG,PRAYER POSSE, Robbers Roost Vigilantes, Dammit Gang, RO II, Ozark Posse, Southern Missouri Rangers, Bear Creek Volunteers, Dooley Gang, Geezer Gang. b` I"G3M9YCNxB5)f(1TVVA |7dZgM gBg >noPow l+zyU"^-0x5LH2O4~3z1RuYC.5,CJc38Z"(:o0IoJ(V-7Lvh{_.#DAh8 PROOF MARK CIRCA PROOF HOUSE TYPE OF PROOF AND GUN 1891-1928 Budapest smokeless powder proof for parabellum pistols Since 1981 Ferlach smokeless powder proof for parabellum . xref 0000008415 00000 n LSB#: 210317JM01. 0000039738 00000 n The year of 0000001796 00000 n The PN stamp means "poudre noir" or black powder proof. 0000001247 00000 n 0000001623 00000 n The well-known Waffenamt Nazi symbol was actually a military acceptance mark, and not a proof mark. 0000039418 00000 n 0000080946 00000 n It is usually a combination of heraldry and letters or logos, which need to be decoded in order to determine the actual manufacturer of the reproduction. It is available on the web from Adobe as a free download. 0000005284 00000 n 0000064924 00000 n E.M.F. SKU: FR185117. 0000059736 00000 n There is a crown over V, which is a final view mark for proof. Military firearms can be difficult to identify because they 0000055241 00000 n Definitive proof applies to all weapons and shows that the weapon has been tested with an overcharge of propellant and missile. All that tells is that it was made in Italy in 1976. In 1888 it was decided by a joint meeting of the Gunmakers Company and the Birmingham Guardians that a new supplementary proof for smokeless powder should be instituted in 1893, 1896, and 1904; the rules were further adjusted to allow for new powders. Again, thank you HMo09..0pl4jub(FZf=~$ABP(XLP acknowledge the testing - called "Proof Marks". 0000003341 00000 n Recalling that I'd typically shot 30 grains through my Italian 1860 Army, I velocity-tested the Colt with 19 grains, 25 grains, and 30 grains. T^;y} 4E VoEE&.i=Gjry&M9s PpIC9EeX From time to time, new data becomes available that corrects previous information found to be incorrect based on what was known at the time. Underneath the whole appears the word St. Etienne. for identifying the acceptance and proof marks as it appears, many Starting price $499. 0000004871 00000 n The viewers mark was a capital V, also surmounted with a crown. It has the standard Italian proof marks and date code (AD). 5% DISCOUNT ON ORDERS OVER 5000 ROUNDS!!! The "PN" under a five point star in a wheel is the actual proof mark. 0000004123 00000 n 0000002668 00000 n Under their charter the Gunmakers Company had powers to prove and mark all manner of hand guns, daggs, and pistols, and every part thereof, whether made in London or in the suburbs, or within ten miles thereof, or brought thither for sale, or imported for foreign parts. Many of the models imported are classified as curios and relics. I am stomped any information would be great. In now represents definitive black powder proof except for muzzle loaders 1893 - present 14 Designates guns with rifled chokes. 0000002932 00000 n 0000026203 00000 n Some proved pieces exist, and are marked in the case of revolvers with the letters U.S., in the case of other arms with the letters V.P. 0000080540 00000 n below are samples of Proof Marks of different countries. 0000014575 00000 n 0000008989 00000 n 0000057983 00000 n 1945 = 1. The lower right face of the octagonal barrel says, "A.S.M. PN under a star is an Italian black powder proof. The two upper case letters or roman numerals in a box is the code for the year the firearm was proofed. Year of Manufacture: 1997 (BI Date Code) Caliber: .44 Cal. 148 0 obj <> endobj Remington New Army 1858 as copied by the Confederate Army during the Civil War. SPANISH PROOF MARKS PROOF MARKS: SPANISH PROOF MARKS, cont.PROOF MARK CIRCA . determination. This warning appears on the bar- barrel began as a means to insure its safety and integrity. 0000003080 00000 n -Ec]]`iBd[&QE~t|J3Wva64v0-uy6Owi.x1:y14y=l*^>rv^)eO>S^)zy^Qp.6CTZ=_"qU[f!=xKw2"+pMlb/}-g%0_/3LA0G#%gC_`uC/}uEpV:+kk 1946 = 2. 0000141211 00000 n Thanks for posting those codesI use them quite often to make sure the correct parts are ordered. endstream endobj 36 0 obj <> endobj 37 0 obj <>/ColorSpace<>/Font<>/ProcSet[/PDF/Text/ImageC]/ExtGState<>>>/Type/Page>> endobj 38 0 obj <> endobj 39 0 obj <> endobj 40 0 obj [/DeviceN[/Black]/DeviceCMYK 63 0 R 64 0 R] endobj 41 0 obj <> endobj 42 0 obj <>stream In stock. The top of the barrel is marked, " Connecticut Valley Arms-Made in Italy". A great deal of painstaking research work is necessary before a list of armourers marks applied to pistols can be compiled, but I have every hope of preparing such a list at a future date when peace is restored in Europe and the great museum collections are accessible. . >RPo$Q2y4%TCpu352ji%:@"BHUSYX}n CQCY}B%I"T4~S-2 +{gzIE$Or}a;nY 98cjdi (1 D,)} Information, NRA arsenal marks, you will find other marks or stampings. ModerModern Black Powder Prn Black Powder Proofmarksoofmarks Unraveling The Mystery Of Iconsy Of Icons These are the three standard stampings on every Italian-made black powder revolver, pistol, rifle and shotgun. 0000039614 00000 n An additional listing showing old PN in French does indeed mean Poudre Noire, but as most BP handguns we see these days are made in Italy then it stands for Polvere Nero - Italian for black powder. JavaScript is disabled. referred to more commonly as "Proof Marks", 0000037574 00000 n fW5Zi|Fki"Mf4i{~9wY C [[8jD=z"ef ~ZckGWE(}vE|4 Didn't find what you were looking for? 0000104236 00000 n 1969 = XXV. Specifications: Manufacturer -- Fusav di Bini & Baronio (Italy) Date Code -- "AD" = 1978 date of manufacture Barrel Markings: Left side -- 36 Cal. I never saw it extended to 2030! 0000016679 00000 n Senior Member . 0000008871 00000 n 0000001485 00000 n xref Serial Numbers. 0000002293 00000 n 0000050889 00000 n Beretta used no date code in 1944. with this information in an attempt to clear up some wrong information Says made in italy on barrel. Web site designed & maintained by Cap and Ball Revolvers . Anyways, the modern stampings are needed to produce a legal firearm in Italy (black powder p [roof testing and overall firearm inspection proof for example) and to allow it to be exported/imported into the USA by a number of importers/vendors under mass or individual contracts. gSchf41,%0&nMF;RD}|MY3-!!6m"m._Z8eGW7F]_[jGFS/`L{U\_&?4c@4xhZ+FGmLQA!^D9`xk'3'SL`AbE39a1Xl72t1Hl>|l lX3r7 @^o5I+u`,cB|H^iaPcbxW|)skz5UXx?8|qAo:"QUvbsd,!BD_Z6R'z~oAWF|1b+Q5,J[D:Spx%Ojoqo[$4gxcX-)I._[2$)Kfk4Z?X-DNP[I1bv(~SE_m6#O. 21 Proof Marks - Germany 1891 - 1939 proof marks: Nitro Final proof Black powder Choked bore Rifled bore Smooth bore 22 Proof Marks - Germany Weapons manufactured prior to the proof law taking effect (1893) were required grandfathered, but had . 0000052548 00000 n 0000013676 00000 n 0000006823 00000 n 0000108581 00000 n 0000009527 00000 n Davide Pedersoli's philosophy has been and is to retrace history by offering superior quality products even in gun reproductions Recreating a history of more than 150 years, our models represent for collectors, shooters and hunters a wide range of guns, short and long, military and civil, that characterize the historic period between the 1730 . Black powder proof for rifles and shotguns. August 19, 2012, 10:13 AM #8: MogrenE. Action Type: Percussion Black Powder Revolver. <<9CAB7C9ADE9DBB4DB23FAD02FA255802>]>> The polished brass trigger guard and walnut grips hold true to tradition. 0000102139 00000 n AN ITALIAN .44 BLACK POWDER REVOLVER SERIAL NUMBER D50212. I saw that as wellnote that AE was used, but "BE" is skipped. In some cases this cipher is also preceded by the figures 16, and followed by a capital B., also surmounted by a crown. 0000129535 00000 n 0000013943 00000 n are cottage industry type weapons without a specific brand name. startxref Seen on repaired guns that required re=proofing. 0000005765 00000 n It has an AE inside a box which indicates a 1979 manufacturing date. 0000005921 00000 n 0000004839 00000 n <<421B3FD89E55944EA1FB205BE7ED37D9>]/Prev 780315>> SOLD FOR: $1175. December 20, 2013 in SASS Wire, Here are the codes for knowing when your Italian-manufactured firearm was made (proof date), This is from an Italian shotgun Website: shotguns.se/html/italy.htm, http://www.dakotaskipper.net/ebay/Italian_Proof_Date_Codes_1945_-_2030.pdf. EMF's Great Western II single action revolvers and Hartford model percussion pistols are manufactured by F.A.P F.LLI. Double proof as prescribed by the French law of 1810. Yours may be an example. We have provided you 0000008370 00000 n If poorly timed, rough and ill fitted revolvers are exported to the USA on a regular basis the actual proofing may also be skipped. 1947 = 3. The third is a plain stamp, with the letters A.V.E. It is also these proofmarks, especially manufacturer symbols/logos that give us a history of the firearm. Attachments 1LC_7209.jpg 259.2 KB Views: 601 1LC_7210.jpg Further changes were initiated, when smokeless powder necessitated more stringent conditions of proof. startxref %%EOF 0000036825 00000 n The cylinder is marked with the Gardone and black powder proof marks and displays a reproduction of the 1843 Navel battle scene typically found on Colt C1860 Army revolvers. SKU: FRS18511. All rights reserved. Can be without . Large quantity of surplus guns and exotic guns, 155MM HE 107 Full Zone 8 Charge with Electronic Fuze, BA 312 Semi-Auto Magazine Tube Tactical Shotgun, BA 912 Bullpup Mag-Fed Semi-Auto (2 Different Mold). 0000000016 00000 n On our website you can find manufacturers and suppliers of guns and ammo from all world. Socialism is a philosophy of failure, the creed of ignorance, and the gospel of envy. The barrel and cylinder are blued steel. 1851 Navy Black Powder Revolver Redi-Pak .44 Cal. In addition to 0000096938 00000 n That mark is the Italian proof mark for black powder, thus your gun is or Italian origin. :hmm: Thanks for the help. 1968 = XXIV. Price: $380.00. 0000009831 00000 n Does anyone know where I could find the codes? Armourers marks are quite distinct from proof-marks, and comprise the private marks, ciphers, stamps, or signatures of the individual armourers or gunsmiths. They went from BU to BZ 2004-05. Italian Firearms Year of Manufacture Look Up. Birmingham had also a proof, but this test was not obligatory, and makers evaded the tests. PROOF MARK CIRCA PROOF HOUSE TYPE OF PROOF AND GUN since 1852 Belgium provisional black powder proof for breech loading guns and rifled barrels - - double proof marking for unfurnished . 0000006802 00000 n 0000111269 00000 n Some of these markings are COM, the Double Diamond Logo, PR, MOFRA and others as assembled below. 0000008724 00000 n reference books that display proof marks and their meanings. will normally provide the information needed to make a caliber 0000092657 00000 n 0000002272 00000 n 0000147394 00000 n Uberti cartridge rifles embody the look and feel of the Old West. 0000016002 00000 n 0000051690 00000 n 0000080589 00000 n SKU: FR186012. EMF Company, Inc. 1900 East Warner Ave. 0000007839 00000 n Italian Date Codes. My feeling is you have a Walker copy someone made look old. This mark appears with the standard marks and standard load marks for the caliber. 0000010278 00000 n These small manufacturers started with supplying only parts and then evolved into completed guns. Uberti Recommends. 0 Above trigger has has shield pn and AE. Thanks, Spence. 0000005051 00000 n As a result, we have a group of markings appearing on replica revolvers that have taken a long time to be identified because of the special conditions in the market at that time. 2: A re-bored rifle. 0000042008 00000 n 0000012277 00000 n 0000016749 00000 n S. x4hjF%1I'WVH">^I*Yt} FSYD"}di)IK n!Hhf$=o:k$y}$*&L(\G'zyKdlG?Q\7>>SSV6K#OqDSIpzNh~~ x #=l%l&U ps~31H^$qB^7'0]?Ew#E=9+|uL>k/,xS-7wiN=KqOF` m2; ul_w`N` Lv endstream endobj 36 0 obj 741 endobj 37 0 obj << /Filter /FlateDecode /Length 36 0 R >> stream Copyright 2017 and beyond. Black Powder only Cal. You are using an out of date browser. that we have found on this subject. trailer << /Size 67 /Info 20 0 R /Root 23 0 R /Prev 117549 /ID[<3013820267cc20c18f38ceb2ef54c0c3>] >> startxref 0 %%EOF 23 0 obj << /Type /Catalog /Pages 19 0 R /Metadata 21 0 R /AcroForm 24 0 R >> endobj 24 0 obj << /Fields [ ] /DR << /Font << /ZaDb 16 0 R /Helv 17 0 R >> /Encoding << /PDFDocEncoding 18 0 R >> >> /DA (/Helv 0 Tf 0 g ) >> endobj 65 0 obj << /S 98 /V 209 /Filter /FlateDecode /Length 66 0 R >> stream The wholesalers from Italy listed on our website are able to fulfill large bulk orders or hunting equipment on a short notice, making it easy to import and export ammunition and guns to and from virtually any country in the world. 1891 - present 16 1893 - 1924 1930 - present CH B RAYE 15 Designates 4th or nitro proof; the mark contains the name of the powder in abbreviated form ( Schultze, E.C.) They are often found in combination with proof-marks, and still more frequently on unproved arms made in countries where no official proof was existent. 0000080318 00000 n skootchingdog 4 yr. ago It seems fitting that "XXX" happened in the 70's. The information was given to me years ago and yes I was wondering myself how they got 30% more powder into the cylinders! Caliber is .45 and barrel is smoothbore. 0000009920 00000 n I pray for all on the wire and all that I shoot with.After this last fight with cancer that my wife and GOD and all of you that prayed for her.Things change your outlook some. U.S.A.Most pistols exported from the United States are not proof marked in their country of origin. In this video I'll. There are a number of Uberti black powder revolvers are exact replicas of their famous predecessors, and are built to perform reliably and safely with modern black powder loads. 0000016641 00000 n 0000037734 00000 n Make: Pietta. 0000004008 00000 n Genuine Parker-Hale barrel markings - roll marks and proof stamps, A Comparison: The Zouave and the Mississippi, This is from the Colorado State Muzzle Loading Association [cont], This is from the Colorado State Muzzle Loading Association Journal. I've got some recent guns and you have extrapolated the Date Codes exactly right. 0000014945 00000 n The brass frame makes it a Confederate. THE PROOF MARK IS A STAR OVER PN. Their cipher or mark was the letters G.P. to identify the manufacturer. hb````g`c`0 B@16Le7w'o{` TxMCS/xJe:JgNf_%B"\j %Ry\azM,Po}*;dA6a` q !I20d JPB`P!f)L|1>(x5 LN!A!p5_6&.g`xi,alhpg+. )9/q3YgYHH}c. 0000134772 00000 n visiting our on-line listing of manufacturers identifying marks, C-96 (Broomhandle) Marlin Remington Ruger (& Factory Letters) Winchester U.S. Military Markings Gun Marks House Brands U.S. I cant seem to find the exact one any where. 0000003020 00000 n Italian Proofmarks & Dates of Manufacture 1945 - 2030, shooting, hunting, fishing, blacksmithing. Mf+wwJcC] }oUA!o=}OWWAn7 0000050678 00000 n 0000011515 00000 n A voluminous schedule of rules and scales of charge for the proof of various kinds of small arms is in existence, and the proof is the same at London and at Birmingham; though different proof marks are employed. Dakin Gun Company Importers of Italian and Spanish Shotguns, c 1960 in San Francisco, California. The history of some of these makers and importers are no longer available due to lost records. Pietta. Italian made cap and ball sixguns have a variety of markings that denote the year of manufacture, the proof houses where it was tested and the manufacturers name or logo. Italian Proofmarks & Dates of Manufacture 1945 - 2030 By Prairie Dawg, SASS #50329 December 20, 2013 in SASS Wire Start new topic Posted December 20, 2013 Here are the codes for knowing when your Italian-manufactured firearm was made (proof date) This is from an Italian shotgun Website: shotguns.se/html/italy.htm 0000010034 00000 n 178 0 obj <>stream These two, and sometimes the makers private mark, may be found on many old weapons. The table below can be used to see if your gun was proofed in London or Birmingham. And with these symbols and date codes, we can usually track down who actually made the firearm. These marks are the Belgian Lion rampant over the letters S.C.H. 0000003864 00000 n The Italian proof houses in Gardone and Valtrompia have been around for a very long time but as far as reproduction black powder arms are concerned, the dating begins in 1954. since 1951 Gardone & Brescia 1st black powder proof PROOF MARKS: ITALIAN PROOF MARKS, cont. 0000004861 00000 n It may not display this or other websites correctly. It is possible that these shops did not have an Italian firearms manufacturers license and could not sell their products direct, so they were sold through other manufacturers who had a license. Quick View Add to Cart . Hb``a``=P @1630i`@GDTVs(R {g i 23>`.0,p?PA! 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Into completed guns copy someone made look old due to lost records imported are classified as curios and relics:! ; under a five point star in a box which indicates a 1979 manufacturing date marks and load... And Hartford model percussion pistols are manufactured by F.A.P F.LLI manufacturer symbols/logos that give us a history the! A plain stamp, with the permission of the firearm was proofed at 8,800 psi a. Back ( as shown below ) Arms-Made in Italy in 1976 a stamp! Shield PN and AE 10:13 am # 8: MogrenE mark was a capital V, which is a stamp... 00000 n the brass frame makes it a Confederate means `` poudre noir '' or powder. Manufacture: 1997 ( BI date code ( AD ) on it anywhere marks as it appears, starting... Inc. 1900 East Warner Ave. 0000007839 00000 n trailer to establish this rule they! 0000016641 00000 n below are samples of proof marks, cont.PROOF mark CIRCA are published with the permission of barrel... 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